Shepherding a Child's Heart (Part 3) | Ep. 107

Journey with us as we explore the basis of parental authority, unpacking biblical principles that lend insight into the responsibility entrusted to us. Ephesians and Deuteronomy are our guides in this episode, shedding light on the roles of parent and child, and the essence of authority that surpasses physical stature or intellectual abilities.

Later, we venture into the realm of discipline, using biblical references to underline its importance. Proverbs and Ecclesiastes caution us against withholding correction from our children, highlighting it as a tool that could save their souls. We turn to the New Testament to learn from Ananias and Sapphira in order to understand the dire consequences of dishonesty. Parenting isn't one size fits all, and accommodating differing personalities is crucial. We discuss the importance of setting tailored short-term and long-term goals for each child recognizing their inherent uniquenesses and differences.

Finally, we delve into discipline as a corrective measure, intended to realign children with God. Drawing inspiration from Moses and David, we underline how discipline should stem from the heart, focusing on character development rather than punishment. The ultimate goal is to guide our children towards holiness and righteousness. 

If you're yearning for a biblical faith-based approach to parenting, you've found your perfect companion in this episode. Listen in, be enlightened, and put into practice the principles in your home as we walk this parenting journey together.

Transcript

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 0:03

The vision received was that of blood cells traveling throughout the body, supplying the much needed oxygen and other nutrients to the differing members of the body to fulfill their purpose. Once the blood cells are spent, they must return back to the heart to be refilled before being sent out again and fulfill their purpose. So that leads us to this idea of who's an authority and why. Some people have just problems with that. Who's an authority and why do they get to be an authority? What is the nature of parental authority? This book answers the question. What is the nature of it? Is it absolute? Is it relative meaning? absolute meaning like a dictator, meaning like I could kill you if you don't obey every single solitary word I state. Is it relative meaning you get to kind of, you know, take it or leave it whenever you want to.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 1:03

Is authority vested in us parents because we're bigger than them? Is that why authority is vested in us? Is it because we're smarter? Is it because we're more experienced? Is it because the children are the sinners and we're not sinners? Well, no, no, no, no and no to all of that. No, that's not. Why Do we have the right to tell them anything we want them to do? Those are some questions that come into the minds of parents as they battle with this. How do I be a parent? How do I, you know, do this right? And so, if you will read Ephesians 6: 1, because this book not only does it gives you counsel, but it gives you the biblical basis for the counsel. So what does it say?

Patricia: 1:55

Children obey your parents in the Lord, for this is right.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 2:00

That's why. Why are parents in authority? Because it says children obey your parents in the Lord. This is right in the eyes of God. Parents were the ones called to be in charge, to be in authority. You have authority because God calls you to be in authority in your child's life. It's directed according to the word, not because you thought it was the best thing. You must shape the lives of your child, not as it pleases you, but you should shape your child as it pleases Him. These are the points of the book taught us.

Patricia: 2:45

Yes, yeah, can I read the next three verses? Because I?

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 2:47

have to go with that Sure Go ahead.

Patricia: 2:51

Starting in verse two, honor thy father and mother, which is the first commandment, with promise that it may be well with you and you may live long on the earth. And, fathers, provoke not your children to anger, but bring them up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 3:08

That's right. One of the reasons that he gives was the fourth commandment. Honor your father and mother that may go well with you. And that doesn't mean children that are toddlers, infants that are adolescents. That means if you're a child, no matter what age you are you should be honoring your father and mother.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 3:39

You should be considering the things that you say, the things that you do And I think I taught this to you guys as you were growing up. They reflect upon your parents and you don't want to do something that's going to reflect wrongly on your parents, because what would that be? You would be dishonoring them. That doesn't honor them when you do something or say something and that gets around and you're the child of so-and-so. You're the child of so-and-so's dad or mom. Wow, what's going on in their house And what was that? third, verse.

Patricia: 4:20

It says that it may be well with you and you may live long on the earth.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 4:24

That was the first commandment with a promise.

Patricia: 4:26

The fourth verse is fathers, provoke, not your children to anger, but bring them up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 4:32

So one of the things that happens to parents is that we get so frustrated because we're not parenting right, the child's not acting right, and so you might do things out of resentment or anger to make them mad, and that's not the way to parent. So just because, father, you're older, you're bigger, you're stronger than your son or your daughter, that doesn't mean you're supposed to wield your physical prowess over them and provoke them to anger. I mean, if you think about it and you take it out to its logical suit at some point, you're not going to be stronger, you're not going to be bigger than them, and they're going to be stronger, bigger than you. But the verse that he addresses in regards to that the parents are called to be in charge is in Deuteronomy, chapter six, verse one and two.

Patricia: 5:39

Now, these are the commandments, the statutes and the judgments which the Lord, your God, commanded to teach you that you might do them in the land, whether you go to possess it, that thou mightest fear the Lord, thy God, to keep all his statutes and his commandments, which I command thee, thou and thy son and thy sons son, all the days of thy life, and thy days may be prolonged.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 6:04

And the other scripture was Ephesians 6: 4, which you already read, about father not provoking their children. But those two verses basically share that both child and parent are under the same master. In other words, they're under the same creator, but they have different roles. The role of the parent is to shepherd, to train, to teach. The role of the child is to obey. You don't know any better, you have to learn. You have to be a pupil, you have to be discipled, and then, when you grow like an apprentice and a master, you start learning the tricks of the trade and the master's gonna teach you. And then you get to be as your master, or like as your master. Well, you can do all of those things on your own, but children are called to obey their parents. Let's read Proverbs 6:23.

Patricia: 7:08

Okay, what's it say? There you go, for the commandment is a lamp and the law is light, and the reproofs of instruction are the way of life.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 7:22

Yeah, as parents, God has given us a duty to perform, and we are to bring commandments that they're not familiar with. We are to bring reproof of instruction regarding their way of life. But one of the things that some parents falter in this area is that they recognize God has given them a duty to perform and they want their child's endorsement. The child's endorsement is not necessary. All a parent needs to know is that this is what God requires of me as a shepherd over our children. So, as I said before, I was never disciplined, and then I started reading some scriptures that were found in this book and I had to make a decision, and so I wanna share with you some of those scriptures. So let's go through four of them Proverbs 13: 24, that'll go to you. Proverbs 19: 18. Well, those two, and then I'll give you the two others. Go ahead.

Patricia: 8:55

He that this is Proverbs 13: 24. He that spares his rod hateth his son, but he that loveth him, chasteneth him be times.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 9:07

In other words, quickly. That's important. I'm gonna get to why that's important. We'll get to that right at the end of all these four. The next one is Proverbs 19:18.

Patricia: 9:18

Chasten your son while there is hope and do not set your soul on making him die.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 9:24

So if we hold back from the rod, meaning the rod of correction, the rod that brings that pow-pow, discipline, that is the sign of that you actually don't love your son. The scriptures say that. I didn't say that. Maybe you have a problem with the scriptures saying, but it said you hate your son. And if you love him, you will not only discipline him with the pow-pow, but you'll do it how? Quickly. You're not gonna wait on it. You're not gonna have your son or daughter do something on this day and then you're gonna pow-pow three days later after you knew all about it, and then you kind of deliberate it because you weren't sure exactly. No, you need to do it quickly and there's a reason for that. I'll get to that in a second.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 10:08

The next one says chasten your son while there is hope, you see, if you don't chasten your son or daughter, it doesn't matter, and you wait too late or to say anything. And what happens if he leaves your house and does something foolish and stupid that you never chasten, and then he ends up getting shot and killed out there. Well, that's on you. How should he have known that he should have acted better or more appropriately if he doesn't hear it from his own home. He goes out in the world and he thinks oh, this is how I'm supposed to be, this is what I should do. Meaning while there's still hope. Meaning that he's still alive. So, at any time that he is acting unbecomingly, while he's still alive, meaning that's while there's hope.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 11:01

You need to chasten him, you need to correct him, you need to rebuke him. And don't stop and spare because he's crying. H e's gonna live. He's not gonna die. Tears that should not stop you from holding, but oh, I don't wanna see him cry. And some of our moms do that. Oh, pobrecito the grandmother's. Oh, Aye the pobrecito! The poor boy! Oh, come on, do you really need to do? Yes, you do. The next two verses or the next two scriptures Proverbs 13. I'm sorry, not 13. Proverbs 23, verse 13 through 14. And then the last one Ecclesiastes 8: 11.

Patricia: 11:51

Withhold not correction from the child, for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die. Thou shalt be him with the rod and shall deliver his soul from hell.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 12:01

There is an eternal ramification for us disciplining our child in the here and now. As parents, we need to be aware of that because if the affirmative in the scriptures is true, then the opposite of that affirmative is also true. So if we don't withhold correction from a child and beat him with a rod, well, he ain't gonna die. Okay, he's not gonna die. That's not the point of disciplining with the pow-pow. If you beat him with a rod, what are you gonna do? eternally speaking, You're gonna save his soul from hell. Well, if you don't discipline, if you don't give the pow-pow what it will be the end result? He might go straight to hell because you didn't do that. Parents need to understand the ramifications of you have a certain amount of authority, power, influence in the person's life that might actually help save them from eternal damnation because you're disciplining him today, even though he may be crying his way through it.

Patricia: 13:16

Ecclesiastes eight, 8:11. Because sentence against an evil work is not executed speedily. Therefore the heart of the sons of men is fully set in them to do evil.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 13:32

There's a lot of people, maybe half of America, that have a problem with capital punishment. I have a problem with capital punishment because it's not executed in the way that it was told to execute. It said because a sentence against an evil work is not executed speedily. It means immediately. Well, what happens? The heart of the sons of men are fully set to them to do evil, because when you execute discipline speedily it acts as a deterrent. But if you elongate that process and they're waiting two, three, four, five, six, seven years, who's gonna be afraid to to to break the law? Nobody! But if you execute that, whatever the consequence was for breaking the law speedily, people are gonna be whoa, whoa, I'm not gonna do that. Did you see what happened to that person? How about this New Testament scripture, two people forgot their names. They'd lie to the Holy Ghost.

Patricia: 14:45

Ananias and Sapphira.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 14:47

Ananias and Sapphira. And Peter said wasn't what you sold always yours? How could you lie to the Holy Ghost, How could you lie to the Spirit? And what happened?

Patricia: 14:59

They dropped dead.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 15:00

They both dropped dead individually, separately. But did you catch what it said afterward? And the fear of the Lord?

Patricia: 15:08

came upon them all.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 15:11

Because they saw God's not playing. You can't do that in front of God's face, in front of everybody, and think that God is not gonna deal with you and have you get away with it. No, he's gonna make an example out of you. If he has to, he will make an example out of you. That's why sometimes it's good for the children to know in your house that this child got disciplined for this reason. Now don't you guys go do the same thing, or the same thing is gonna happen to you. That's the way it should be in your home. You're not showing partiality over one child over another. Now you will deal with them differently, based upon their ages, based upon their individual personalities. You might have one that is actually and you could tell they're really, really repentant, and then you have one that is really, really rigidly unrepentant. You may show more mercy on that one child because they are sincerely repentant, and the one that's not, you're gonna bring down the hammer, you're gonna bring down the fire, because that is the way God says, "Foolishness is bound up in the heart of the child, but the rod of correction will drive it far from him. So we're just trusting in the Lord, that well, that's what he said to do And you're still gonna do the communication part. It's not like you're not gonna do that, but there are some levels of obstinacy.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 16:44

You've read the Old Covenant. You've read the Old Covenant. You saw how God dealt with his people. There came a point in time where I'm not gonna wrestle with man forever. You wanna go that route? Okay, I gave you all of these kings, I gave you all of these prophets And you continue to wanna go the way that you went. Well, what happened to them? Number one, the kingdom was divided. And number two, the northern king was taken over by Assyria and the southern kingdom was taken over by Babylon, and they were in captivity for nearly 70 years. He will bring the judgment. If you will not respond, if you will not listen, if you will could remain stiff neck, then he's gonna bring the hammer down. Does he want you to die? No, but he does want you to repent And that's why he brought that consequence to them of being in captivity.

Patricia: 17:34

Yes, There was a scripture. I remember reading it to the kids. I don't know what was going on during that time, but we did a Bible study and I don't know if you were very upset and impacted by it, because in the Old Testament there was a family that they had a son who was very rebellious And it came a point in time when the Lord said, or the leader of the people of that group, bring him out, And they stoned that kid. And the kids my, our children were like, yeah, like mom, You know.

Patricia: 18:08

but the point that I was trying to make to them is we cannot think that we can continue in rebellion and in sin. There will be a consequence, there's grace, but there's a point in time It's as. the Lord will not deal with, it will not contend with man forever. And I wanted I don't remember what happened with them that I wanted to make that point very clear to them. But I remember their reaction when we do you remember that? when I read that to y'all? I don't remember the specific instance, but I remember us being scared after reading old covenant stories multiple times.

Patricia: 18:45

But it was it wasn't like it was like to to let them know that you know other people, you know cause. Something else you know when we're disciplining our children. We know our children. And then you have those grandparents or saints from the church that love your kids and, oh, they're so sweet And you know our. They're so well behaved.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 19:07

I mean, they're much better than those out there.

Patricia: 19:10

Yeah, so they start doing that comparison. But the thing is that you as a parent, know, you know what standard has been set in the home and where the child might have skirted something that you said, and you're trying to execute the authority that the Lord gave you to deal with the situation, and so you know that's even having to. I wrote notes I was looking at. When you're parenting, you have to be prepared to swim upstream, because our culture is not on board with our authority And our culture sometimes can be in the body of Christ, our family members. You know my mom and dad. My mom was a disciplinarian, but I heard from the kids thank God I didn't hear this one. I was dealing with the kids, but their nickname for me was drill sergeant. My parents named me that towards the way I treated the kids. Yet the comment was always that our kids were very well-behaved. So and I didn't really.

Patricia: 20:13

I thought I was actually a little too soft with them, but in the mind of those around you, you know, we have to be, we have to have a very clear understanding of what you have just been stating. This is not our idea, it's not our standards, it's God's. This is what God says and this is what we are to, if we're gonna be obedient to the word of God and we're gonna be obedient with the way we raise our children, we have to do what He said. Otherwise, it's not just that they might go to hell, but we're also gonna stand before the Lord in judgment for what we did not do. And if you do everything right, if you do what the Lord says in your child's still as wayward that's between your child and God. You can say that.

Patricia: 21:00

But if you can take honest inventory, if they're young now and you know, oh, I think I'm a little soft or I get swayed by the crying, or I don't wanna be bothered, because a lot of parents, you know you're tired from your job, whatever you're doing, and you think let me just let them, you know, hash it out with themselves and then I'll just put them to bed. But that's not what the Lord said. And so you know we have to, there has to be a repentance, a repentant heart on the part of parents. And I know, for when I was parenting, I never thought I did it right completely And I always had to be taking inventory. You know, how could I have done that?

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 21:42

better.

Patricia: 21:43

Yeah, a lot of reflecting, And sometimes you and I helped each other reflect. Sometimes we don't like how we reflected, but it was necessary to sharpen iron, sharpens iron and to come in and always, we always wanted to make our standard the Bible, not anybody else's opinion, not this psychologist or that psychologist or this therapist or even well-meaning friends. What The psychologist said. Would you just make the?

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 22:12

standard the Bible. Was that what was communicated to you, That the things that we did in our home were because we were applying the Bible?

Patricia: 22:24

Yes, generally speaking.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 22:27

Generally.

Patricia: 22:28

Because some things we felt after hearing stories of upbringing that might have had an influence on some of the decisions as well.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 22:38

I don't understand.

Patricia: 22:39

Certain standards in the house. Yes, there were a lot of biblical principles, but when it came to certain expectations in the house there were some things regarding cleaning and whatnot We kind of felt, oh, this may be.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 22:53

They got it from this person, they got it from that person.

Patricia: 22:55

They might have gotten it or the idea from this experience. Or like even chores, for example, it's biblical that we are supposed to obey you, but the chores starting to wash dishes, that was an idea from someone else you guys had met that had their children do it to teach them personal responsibility. So that would be an instance where I could say, nah, that's not necessarily biblical. It is in the sense of instilling personal responsibility and consequences, et cetera.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 23:24

The idea of the method, the idea of the method, No, the idea of the method may not have been like straight from the Bible. I mean, the Bible doesn't tell its teacher kids to wash their dishes or clean the room, method wise.

Patricia: 23:37

Okay, the methods. Yes, methods were different, but principles wise, usually we're justifiable. Yes.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 23:45

So I just spent a lot of time talking about the disciplining part, but I did say, or the book actually says, it's not just discipline, it's communication and discipline. So it's not all about discipline, this parenting aspect. There has to be what we call in teaching "teachable moments. We as parents have to be sensitive to the Lord, discerning those teachable moments. As teachers your wife, my wife and I, we kind of know that because we're in class all the time and there's always these teachable moments". Some people don't understand it because they're not teachers. It's just finding those moments where there's actually like an open door so that you can kind of amplify a certain principle or a concept that maybe you've been trying to address with them. And then something just happened and you're like oh, that's great connection that I can make to them. So we wanna do that and the scriptures do teach that. So in Deuteronomy, chapter six, verse six and seven, can someone read that?

Patricia: 24:58

And these words which I command thee this day shall be in thine heart and thou shalt teach them diligently unto thy children and shall talk of them when thou sit is in thine house and when thou walkest by the way, and when thou liest down and when thou riseth up.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 25:15

That scripture gives me the impression that all of the statutes of the Lord, the commandments of the Lord, were to be teaching to mature children at all times. It doesn't have to say it all times, but it's saying, man, when you're sitting in your house, when you're walking down the road to your neighbor's house or going to do this or going to do that, or when you're lying down before you go to bed, or when you rise up, you should be instructing them in the commandments of the Lord. And so that's where you get the teachable moments. Throughout your day. Maybe you're out in the yard doing some yard work. You could be working with your son or working with your daughter and teaching them about. One of these days the Lord's gonna come back and he's gonna be so fed up with all of these tears, all these weeds, all these stores that he's gonna come with the sickle and take them all out, which is what we're doing right now, as we're trying to clean up our yard and get rid of all the weeds and all of this stuff. He's gonna do that at some point. And there's an example of a teachable moment.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 26:20

Children must be made to understand life, themselves, and their own needs from a biblical perspective, parents should be establishing that biblical, what we call a biblical worldview, a biblical perspective on life. Parents need to know what makes their children tick and how they are unique from others. They, of all people, should know better, and so, with that, we need to implement clear training objectives, and so one of the things your mom and I did you were not privy to maybe you overheard the conversation, I don't remember, but we would sit down and we would talk about because it was kind of given to us, as this is a method that you might want to implement in your home list the strengths and weaknesses of each of your children. Look at how this child is different from this child, their personalities, what are their gifts, what are their inclinations, their personality traits. You know, like I always remember this personality trait, which really clarified for me how you and John were so different.

Patricia: 27:39

Yeah.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 27:41

In Miami we took you both out to ride bicycles, But I think, I don't think you had training wheels.

Patricia: 27:48

Okay.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 27:50

Did he have training wheels?

Patricia: 27:51

I can't remember, it doesn't matter.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 27:53

The point is, we went to the park where there was a pathway to go, to go around We all had bikes, right? I think you had a bike too, or were you walking?

Patricia: 28:01

We were walking, No no, they were bikes.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 28:03

I was on my bike because I was riding my bike with the person that just kept on. Lydia went, she just went, started riding, so I was following after her and John I think he was still in his training wheels. John did not have the strength, the stamina, the endurance to keep up with you. So his attitude was well, if I can't go fast like my sister, I'm going to go really pokey slow. And that's what he did. And he just, he just went. And I was like John, come on, nope, I can't keep up with her, I'm going to go even slow. And that was their personality. You were the first born personality. Let's go. I learned this, I'm gone. And then him well, I can't keep up with this. And then Deborah was the one that would. So here's another example of how we saw their different personalities.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 28:56

We went on our beach trip to Naples Was it Naples? And so we're teaching you how to swim. You've all been taking lessons. And so Lydia comes first, jumps in the pool, jumps, swims to the other side. Okay, then John is next. John jumps into the pool, swims to the other side And I'm turning my back on Deborah who's waiting, so that John can get to the other side And what do I hear? Splash! And I turn around. Deborah, what are you doing? And she would never be left behind. That has always been Deborah's personality. I'm not going to get left behind. Deborah can go, and I mean Lydia can go and John can go, but I'm going to be right behind y'all. I'm going to try to catch up to you, which is why she excelled in her athletics because she was always trying to catch up to you, always trying to catch up to John.

Patricia: 29:37

And that's why she excelled. She would play up.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 29:39

Yeah, and exactly, it caused her to play up from her age level and to be better than those that were at her age level, because she was playing up. So those are the little things that we had conversations about. Recognize it. Do you see that same thing? Do I see this? And sometimes today, even now, we're like, eh, I don't actually see it that way, and she sees it a different way, and that's fine. But we did that, we looked at, we talked about, well, what are the short-term goals we have? What are the long-term goals we have? And they were different for each child. They were different. They were different for each child, but they were also similar.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 30:15

And as we dealt with you in homeschooling as a group, where do we want all of our children to get to? Maybe it was academically. And then we talked about our strategies for parenting. We always talk there. That's where she said sometimes we had to reflect, did that work? And then she maybe be kind of upset because I might say like, well, no, you talk too much, you had to just get the discipline. And she might be upset because, no, but I'm like, no, you just had to do that. Or maybe it was. Maybe I was too harsh, rough, abrupt, and she might say that to me.

Patricia: 30:54

Can I say something? Yeah yeah, yeah, because, as you're saying all this, you said you have to set up a standard for your kids. And yeah, we reflected and looked at, but we were when they were little little, we this is a doable for little kids We taught them what obedience looked like. There were three things that I think they still do. You still remember what it was? Let's see if you remember. See, I was thinking about that.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 31:18

Yeah, i haven't gotten there. I haven't in my notes. I haven't gotten there.

Patricia: 31:21

I saw I'm like I know one started with M and I remembered that one, but I don't remember the other two. Well, that would be, I guess murmuring, but Yes that one. It was without challenge or without murmuring or contesting or arguing.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 31:34

Murmuring and complaining is how you say it Without excuse, and without delay, so immediately.

Patricia: 31:40

And I flipped it because I remember immediately was the first thing They had to do, right?

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 31:45

away.

Patricia: 31:45

You had to do it right away. You had to do it without making excuses which is why you would get woken up in the middle of the night if you didn't take care of something by your dad. And then without complaining and arguing, which would guarantee that you were gonna get disciplined. Any one of those not being done, and also for the first one, you guys used to say delayed obedience is disobedience to us as well. I remember that.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 32:12

Dodd, dod, dodd. Yeah, delayed obedience is disobedience. Okay, I didn't remember that, but that was one.

Patricia: 32:20

I do.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 32:22

Okay, so we talked about a strategies for parenting. you know we also talked about the methods and approaches for addressing the attitudes of the heart and how to address them. We were both constructively critical on how each one addressed each particular individual.

Patricia: 32:42

You also talked. you both touched on our sharpening iron Something I will say. I am not a parent but as a child I can speak on this. Be careful in your disagreements in front of your children. It didn't necessarily happen with us, but we would see it with our friends and we would all talk about it Like you knew what kind of thing you might get away with with one parent but not the other. Children are very intelligent. Oh, I totally think it happened in this house.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 33:12

They're very astute.

Patricia: 33:14

Well, not just us, I mean, as in you guys disagreeing in front of us. You guys did make a very concerted effort not to Occasionally it would still happen, because you're human And we get it. Now that we're older. They're like, yeah, they're human. As children we had a beacon for that and knew okay, so Dad will not be as strict about cleaning. I can get away with this type of cleaning in my room if Dad checks the room And we knew if Mom's checking the room.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 33:46

We have to change how we clean it.

Patricia: 33:49

Different.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 33:51

That's absolutely true, that's just one example.

Patricia: 33:54

But we also knew, like, for example again, this is why the crying thing when Dad said that I was laughing because I'm like, yeah, you really shouldn't just because they're crying because I do remember that we reached an age where I take responsibility for this as the older child doing this, and I gave advice to my siblings when they're going to get paddled, how many there should be before he started crying. So it looks legitimate because what would happen is one of us would start crying immediately without being touched. The other person would be too tough And that would. that would usually cause a response to okay, so he's going to be obstinate, you're going to get more. So my advice in that moment was you need to, okay. so after like this many, then let some tears fall, even if you don't feel like crying. you won't want to, because that's the cue They'll stop. And I remember telling, not in so many words, it's much more articulate now, but as a child that's what I remember.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 35:00

I would think so I was like God.

Patricia: 35:01

really No, but I remember expressing you can't cry right now, like stop crying.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 35:07

Wait until it happens a couple times.

Patricia: 35:09

I had that one child. That was the anticipation child. The anticipation of the consequence was what would set it off. So I bring that up to say parents are not perfect, and I get that, but as a child, especially if your children are intelligent, which most of them are- do you notice way

Patricia: 35:27

more than you think. And then they might express be careful when you're disagreeing on how to punish, be careful with standards, making sure, yeah, you guys will not be the exact same and everything. but on the things that matter and are most important in your house, making sure you guys are on the same page, Because if your kids find out that you guys are not on the same page on something, they will exploit it, They will use that.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 35:53

Yeah, the spirit, the enemy, will work through your children to try to bring division and put pitch you against each other. I don't think we've gone to that yet, but yeah, that is something that we we made an effort to be on the same page. On everything, I believe we were on the same page but being different people, I just think that we executed differently.

Patricia: 36:23

Like you said, we won't do this. And so but you have a different idea of where's the standard?

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 36:31

where's the stopping point? where's?

Patricia: 36:33

the. It's not coming to me the word, but the line. Where's the line? where do we draw the line? It might have been different.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 36:39

Yeah, maybe, okay. So let me finish out this. the methods and the approaches for the attitudes is hard, and how to address them. In Genesis 18:19, who's next? Okay, what does that say?

Patricia: 36:54

Genesis 18:19 says, for I know him, that he will command his sons in his house after him, that they shall keep the way of Jehovah to do justice and judgment. That Jehovah may bring upon Abraham that which he has spoken of him.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 37:09

That's right. So when we addressing the attitudes of heart, we are trying to teach our children to keep the way of the Lord, knowing, helping them to know and understand. What is God standard for children, which is why we read the scriptures obey your parents, teaching them that they are sinners. They're not perfect, neither are we, and we taught you, I think we taught you guys, neither are we. We don't get it right all the time. Hopefully it wasn't like we were trying to pass ourselves off as perfect And pointing them to the grace and mercy of God through Christ's life and why he died for sinners such as all of us.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 37:54

Now we do come to the part where they talked about how parents are sometimes misguided. The book talks about parents being misguided, and some parents believe that their anger has a legitimate place in correction and discipline, and it doesn't have any place. Discipline should never be ushered out in an emotional outburst of anger. That's one major thing the book did teach us. Discipline should be a time where mom and dad well, again, one of the misguided conceptions of parenting is that disciplining should be a time when mom and dad manipulate their children through outbursts of anger and displays that cause the child to fear Because you can, and you can easily do that with children. You can make children very afraid very quickly, easily as a parent, and that's not something you want to do.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 38:57

We're not. Parenting is not trying to establish a fear of man in children, because that is only going to produce performance again. It's not about performance. And if a parent does do that in a misguided way, what that teaches the child is to learn to fear man and not God, which is actually opposite of everything that shepherding a child's heart is about. We're trying to teach them how to fear God, and let fearing God be what motivates them intrinsically to do what that thing. That is right. Let's read James 1, verse 19 and 20.

Patricia: 39:38

That's you right, mm-hmm. Wherefore, my beloved brethren, let every man be swift to hear, slow to speak and slow to wrath. for the wrath of man work, if not the righteousness of God?

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 39:52

Yeah, and that's a good scripture to point to parents Your wrath does not bring about the righteousness of God, I think. A good biblical example, Moses he was leading the people.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 40:08

This was the second time that it happened. People were murmuring and complaining. He's murmuring and complaining, and the Lord told Moses this second time around to do what to the rock? Speak to the rock, he said. Speak to the rock. In Moses' anger and frustration with the children, he struck the rock. It still gave out water, but he paid the penalty. He couldn't go into the Promised Land. Because what Moses didn't know is that he had already struck the rock once.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 40:42

This is all prophetic, and I just this is the teachable moment. The first time he struck the rock, it was prophetic. The rock was representative of Christ, and out of the rock came the rivers of water, living water, that the people needed. But after that, you don't strike the rock again. Christ is stricken smitten once, and the rock was a prophet. Christ is stricken smitten once For all mankind. And so the next time you come to the Lord and you're in need, instead of murmuring and complaining like all of Israel was doing, you speak to the rock. Oh Jesus, I need your help here. But no, Moses got angry and struck the rock, and then he couldn't enter into the Promised Land. So that's a good example that your anger is not going to bring about the righteousness of God that you want through your children. We need to be aware of that.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 41:31

Discipline should always be corrective, not punitive. It's not because we're offended Although sometimes that does get in there. You know you embarrassed me How could you do such a thing? Or an anger, or because you're vindictive, or because you're irritating me and I can't stand how you're acting right now. So I'm just going to swatch you and tell you to go to your room. It's not about airing out our frustration. Those are all misguided attempts at parenting And we have to be in control of that.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 42:06

Discipline orbits around God is the one that was offended. What did David say? He said until you, God alone, have I sinned against. And that's the attitude that we're trying to get our children to understand, not because I'm a child, but because I'm a child. I'm trying to get our children to understand, not because I personally am offended at how poorly you're behaving and how you created a ruckus in Walmart and created a scene and you embarrassed me. That's not why you want to swat your child.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 42:41

You're trying to discipline, to bring your child back into right relationship with God And you're bringing about a restoration, because anytime anyone sins and you're separating themselves from God. So you want to do it in an attitude of restoration of your child back into right relationship with God. So discipline is, then, remedial. It's designed to move the child who has disobeyed God back into the path of obedience, which brings restoration And that brings about righteousness, That brings about peace, because you've rescued them from the path of danger and destruction and you've brought them onto the pathway of holiness or righteousness. So this discipline that we might need to give in the moment not that everything needs discipline, but if there is discipline, we need to try in every way, shape and form connected to the principles found in God's word And that must be communicated to the child. So the issue of discipline is for character development. You're developing the character of Christ in them and having children learn to honor God at all times. Thus is the ministry of our Father's heart through us. Our utmost desire is to be in the Father's heart, to know the Father's heart and express the Father's heart to you.

j - Jesus M. Ruiz: 44:11

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